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   ► MB LobbyCorel Paradox / ObjectPAL Coding BoardParadox Setup, Vista, etc. Topic   Print This     

Paradox on Windows Server 2012

Paradox on Windows Server 2012 in Paradox Setup, Vista, etc. topic (part of our Corel Paradox / ObjectPAL Coding group).

Quick Search: Paradox   Windows   Paradox Windows   Paradox Windows Server  
gcorvera
-- UNK

We migrated from using a run of the mill Windows XP box as a server to Windows Server 2012; one of the applications we use is a simple 3 table database which stopped working the moment the files were being accessed from the new server. We could see data but trying to add anything would result in a Lock Time Out error.

I discovered that if I remove Referential Integrity from the detail table structure, and just assign it through the data model on the form, everything works.

Would it be OK to leave it like that? or would it be somehow dangerous for the integrity of the data?

Could the problem have come from some setting on the server? The person who installed the server for us doesn't think so but I'm not sure he is as familiar with Windows 2012 Server as I thought.

For the time being I will be monitoring the data and checking that nothing is lost.

Any suggestions?

Thanks

 Posted 6 years ago (Thread Starter)
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Post ID #15153, 20 replies
Thread Started 6/2/2014 12:27:41 PM
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Last Reply Posted 1/24/2020 7:35:33 AM)
Location=-- UNK 
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Wakinyan
Sinclair Manufacturing
-- --

Resurrection...

Lock Time Out errors - I am currently dealing with this, have Microsoft involved as well.

Two weeks ago, we migrated from Server 2008 R1 (Vista based) to Server 2016 (Win 10 based). We run Paradox (Office X6) on clients from XP, 7, 10 x86 / x64, and ONLY store the data on the server's mapped drives.

Paradox locks, crashes, does not behave well at all when pointing to the new server (*).
Through much testing, pointing to a Win8.1 box as a "server", works fine. Pointing to a test Server 2012 R2 box, works fine. Point to the 2016 box, and things get REALLY strange.

Pointing to a 2016 Domain Controller's shared test folder, Paradox WORKS. Huh. fails on File Server, runs on DC.

File Server (2016) #1, RAID1 (2x drives) for OS, shared folder on C:\ WORKS. Running from the RAID 10 (4x drives) data partition, fails the way I mentioned.

File Server (2016) #2, RAID 10 (6x drives, broken up into 2 partitions, 300Gb for OS, 1500Gb for data), WORKS on C: partition, fails on data partition. Install Windows Server 2016 on data partition to make it bootable, etc., FAILS. Make C:\ the entire disk, if WORKS.

I see that X8 is out. While I doubt there's been ANY changes, I'm going to try it and see if it works at all. We've been running this / some iteration of my Paradox app to run the company since... mid 90's, and the boss doesn't want to replace it before he retires. :)

 Posted 30 months ago
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Post ID #16789 (Level 2) and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 7/21/2017 5:17:25 AM
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SamSpade
DBusSol
-- USA

Did anyone get anywhere with the Server 2016 question?

I am migrating a Paradox 11 app from a 2008 R2 terminal server to a 2016 terminal server and I am having some trouble. I have not explored corel X9.  Since Paradox 11 installs, I am hoping to go with that.

When I access a single table with multiple users, the first user controls the table and edits are not seen by other users. And only the first users edits are saved.

I don‘t know if it‘s a server permissions issue, Oplocks or a BDE.CFG settings issue.

I am going to try all my old Win XP reg edits. 

I am a little out of my depth on the permissions issues.

Is anyone successfully using server 2016 terminal server for multi user paradox apps?

 Posted 8 months ago
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Post ID #17498 (Level 3) and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 5/1/2019 10:22:13 PM
Location=-- USA 
Joined=8 months ago   MB Posts=13  
Wakinyan
Sinclair Manufacturing
-- --

Sam,

I am hosting Paradox 11 databases on the Server 2016 file server.

I bought the newer versions Corel's Office suite, and it's the SAME Paradox build - there's been zero development on it.

I had the server broken up as described, separate Windows / Data partitions on the RAID array. That was unsuccessful.
The only way I could get Paradox to work as it did on Server 2008 was to put the data files on the C partition. Totally the WRONG way to make it work.

So, I now have a large C partition on the array, with Windows AND all data on the same partition. It works as before, with the clients running 11, and data on mapped shared drive on the file server.

Just my experiences. Best of luck.

 Posted 8 months ago
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Post ID #17501 (Level 4) and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 5/2/2019 4:52:11 AM
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Steven.G
Myrtle Beach, SC USA

Sam.. first rule of sharing..

all users must point to the exact same net file, using the exact same mapping.. can't just resolve to same place, must be the same

all users must point to the shared data, using the exact same mapping.. can't just resolve to same place, must be the same

all users must have full read/write/create/delete for all folders with paradox objects, so it can create, modify, and delete the lock files, even if it's not gonna do that to the objects themselves

Steven Green
Senior Software Engineer
Paradox Support Specialist DOS/WIN

Prestwood IT Solutions
8421 Auburn Blvd, Suite 256, Citrus Heights, CA 95610
Office: 916-726-5675 | Fax: 916-726-5676 | http://www.prestwood.com
 Posted 8 months ago
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Post ID #17502 (Level 5) and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 5/2/2019 5:41:12 AM
Location=Myrtle Beach, SC USA 
Joined=40 months ago   MB Posts=338  
rum
Frankfort, KY USA

Sam,  After I switched to Paradox 11,  I had issues that may be similar,  although they did  manifest differently.

In my scenario,  the 2nd, 3rd,etcuser would get an error saying they could not open a specific library. 

I tried for weeks to program around it. From the server, looking at the file locks for user 1 it showed that I had the file open for read.   for user 2 it reported that the file had an exclusive lock on it and could not be opened.

I was able to solve this issue by placing the library in a common path on the server,   

I used the server equivalent of 

C:\Program Files (x86)\Paradox\Programs

All other program items remained on the data drive.


We had one other issue,  related to the PRIVATE folder.  The default configuration of the terminal server users will cause each user to USE the same path for the private folder.   In this case we use the -p command line switch to redierct paradox private folder to  C:\Users\USERNAME\AppData\Local\Temp

Jeff

 Posted 8 months ago
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Post ID #17503 (Level 6) and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 5/2/2019 6:14:13 AM
Location=Frankfort, KY USA 
Joined=31 months ago   MB Posts=101  
SamSpade
DBusSol
-- USA

I think I have done everything in the previous suggestions, but I am still seeing the issue where user2 doesn't see edits by user1 if User2 opens the table while User1 has the table in edit. It's like each user is working in the table in memory seperately and the user who opens the table first blocks other users from saving edits.

I think this is an Oplocks error, but I haven't figured it out.

I am pretty sure I am using all the Reg edits and settings except Init\Localshare  = True

If someone knows of something I am not using, please point it out.

Here's what I have done On a Server 2016 Terminal server:

In Powershell as administrator

Set-SMBServerConfiguration -EnableOplocks $false

Set-SMBServerConfiguration -EnableLeasing $false

Set-SMBClientConfiguration -OplocksDisable $True

Set-SMBClientConfiguration -UseOpportunisticLocking $False

In RegEdit in LanmanWorkstation\Parameters\

EnableOplocks was not set, so I set it to 0

In Lanmanserver, EnableOplocks was 0 EnableOplocksForceclose was 1

Restart the server to make regedits take effect

I am using a -P command to set individual User :Priv: Dirs

I am using a -O command to ensure all users use the same .CFG

-W command for common working directory

The .CFG file sets Alias for Forms and Data directories

.CFG defines a common .net file in C:\Paradox\App\Active\

Installed Paradox11

Created a directory C:\Paradox\App\Active\ for Forms\ and Data\ directories

Used Properties of APP\ to set full control for Users group

     In the Security Tab set Full control for users group

     In the Advanced Security settings use inheritence and setup for full control by users group

Copy the a reference copy of server 2008R2  Data\ and Forms\ directory to Server 2016

Log into Server 2016 Terminal server with User1 and User2

Use Shortcut with Command line to open paradox form Viewing to test.DB in both users

Both user add records to the table on screen error free

After closing the form, only User1 edits are saved to the table

 Posted 8 months ago
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Post ID #17504 (Level 7) and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 5/2/2019 12:54:11 PM
Location=-- USA 
Joined=8 months ago   MB Posts=13  
Jeff Wampler
12:34 MicroTechnologies
-- USA

I read what you did to solve you problem, but it doesn't seem to be working in our setup and I'm not sure I follow what you did exactly. We have Paradox 11 running on a 2016 Terminal Server. The databases are stored on 2019 File Server. It seems like you are saying to make the SMB changes on the terminal server. Wouldn't you need to make the SMB server changes on the file server and the SMB client changes on the terminal server? Also, I'm not following the -P command and -O command? Can you elaborate? I'm not a Paradox expert at all. We have a gentelman at one of our customers that insists on using it and I'm now tasked with getting it working no their new terminal servers. Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

Regards,

Jeff

 Posted 8 days ago
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Post ID #17822 (Level 1.1)  Reply to 17504 and Parent is 15153
Thread Started 1/21/2020 5:54:15 AM
Location=-- USA 
Joined=77 days ago   MB Posts=11  
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Steven.G
Myrtle Beach, SC USA

-p and -o are command line switches for paradox, in the shortcut on the desktop.. -p tells where the "temp files" folder is, and must be unique.. -o tells it where the shared cfg file is

SMB is becoming a significant issue for old desktop apps like paradox, dbase, access, etc

Steven Green
Senior Software Engineer
Paradox Support Specialist DOS/WIN

Prestwood IT Solutions
8421 Auburn Blvd, Suite 256, Citrus Heights, CA 95610
Office: 916-726-5675 | Fax: 916-726-5676 | http://www.prestwood.com
 Posted 8 days ago
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Post ID #17823 (Level 2.1)  Reply to 17822 and Parent is 15153
Thread Started 1/21/2020 6:36:00 AM
Location=Myrtle Beach, SC USA 
Joined=40 months ago   MB Posts=338  
SamSpade
DBusSol
-- USA

Jeff,

Yes, the File Server needs to be dealt with also

Setting the Oplock settings might be enough, but I would do the SMB settings as well and make sure the Sharing is set in the CFG file.

If you can move the paradox data etc to a drive native to the terminal server, you will see a signifigant performance boost.

I haven't installed on a Server 2019, I am not sure if that adds any complications.

I have two successfull installs using terminal server 2016 running now, but nothing on 2019.

 Posted 8 days ago
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Post ID #17827 (Level 2.2)  Reply to 17822 and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 1/21/2020 5:31:56 PM
Location=-- USA 
Joined=8 months ago   MB Posts=13  
Jeff Wampler
12:34 MicroTechnologies
-- USA

I'll give it a go. We really have two problems with Paradox that we are dealing with. One is that some of the functions that the users do in the database just don't seem to work on the 2016 terminal server. The other is with reporting. We have an old ERP system that uses a VB program to run Crystal Reports. It only supports Crystal 8.5. All the reports that are built around SQL data work absolutely fine. Any reports that pull in Paradox data work intermittently or no at all. I'm hoping the SMB and OpLocks changes fix both issues. Now on to another question. We have other users that have the runtime running on their Windows 10 desktops connecting to the same databases on the file server. Do you think the oplocks settings will need to be changed on all the desktops too? What's odd to me is that the databases and reporting work fine on the Windows 10 desktops currently, but not on the terminal server. I would think if it were SMB related it would affect servers and workstations?

Thanks,

Jeff

 Posted 7 days ago
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Post ID #17828 (Level 3.1)  Reply to 17827 and Parent is 15153
Thread Started 1/22/2020 3:29:35 AM
Location=-- USA 
Joined=77 days ago   MB Posts=11  
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Steven.G
Myrtle Beach, SC USA

Jeff.. please givee specific examples of what "functionality" doesn't work, different issues have different solutions

Steven Green
Senior Software Engineer
Paradox Support Specialist DOS/WIN

Prestwood IT Solutions
8421 Auburn Blvd, Suite 256, Citrus Heights, CA 95610
Office: 916-726-5675 | Fax: 916-726-5676 | http://www.prestwood.com
 Posted 7 days ago
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Post ID #17829 (Level 4.1)  Reply to 17828 and Parent is 15153
Thread Started 1/22/2020 8:17:11 AM
Location=Myrtle Beach, SC USA 
Joined=40 months ago   MB Posts=338  
...
Jeff Wampler
12:34 MicroTechnologies
-- USA

I'll have to get back to you on that. I'll need to get our Paradox guy to elaborate on the issues he is seeing. May be a day or two.

 Posted 7 days ago
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Post ID #17830 (Level 5.1)  Reply to 17829 and Parent is 15153
Thread Started 1/22/2020 8:22:31 AM
Location=-- USA 
Joined=77 days ago   MB Posts=11  
Jeff Wampler
12:34 MicroTechnologies
-- USA

We made the changes last night on the terminal server and the file server and then did some testing. It seemed to be working ok. In fact, the reports that use Paradox data were now running on the new servers. We were still experiencing issues opening some tables in Paradox from other servers that had no problems prior to the change, and we couldn't even launch Paradox on the old terminal servers? Kept getting an error that we couldn't open PDOXUSERS.NET.

Here is a little more background info...

List of Servers:

Crystal - Server 2019 - This is the file server that stores the Paradox files, it also runs Paradox Runtime, Crystal Reports and an IIS based automated report runner. There is a drive that is labeled as drive P: which contains all the Paradox files. This drive is then shared and mapped for users as the P: drive on their systems. Scheduled reports run fine on this server.

Automate - Currently Server 2008 R2, but needs to be rebuilt to 2016. - This server runs an automation tool and has the full version of Paradox installed on it.

Citrix1, 2, 3, 4 – Citrix Terminal Servers running 2008 R2 – Current fully published desktop that runs Paradox Runtime along with all other user applications, ERP, etc. Working fine with current settings on file server.

Xenapp1 and 2 – Citrix Terminal Servers running 2016 – New fully published desktop runs Paradox Runtime along with all other user applications, ERP, etc. Crystal reports run from ERP custom report executor completely fail, or only work intermittently.

Desktops and laptops – Running W10 1903 or 1909 – Either Paradox or Paradox Runtime installed. Some have a local install of the ERP and the reports run fine from the Custom Report Executor.

 Posted 5 days ago
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Post ID #17833 (Level 3.2)  Reply to 17827 and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 1/24/2020 4:20:23 AM
Location=-- USA 
Joined=77 days ago   MB Posts=11  
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Steven.G
Myrtle Beach, SC USA

> Kept getting an error that we couldn't open PDOXUSERS.NET <

either the workstations reporting that error haven't been configured properly (open the BDE and set the correct path to the shared NET file), or the changes you made have left behind the old lock files (check the "private" folder for two *.lck files and delete them)

Steven Green
Senior Software Engineer
Paradox Support Specialist DOS/WIN

Prestwood IT Solutions
8421 Auburn Blvd, Suite 256, Citrus Heights, CA 95610
Office: 916-726-5675 | Fax: 916-726-5676 | http://www.prestwood.com
 Posted 5 days ago
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Post ID #17834 (Level 4.1)  Reply to 17833 and Parent is 15153
Thread Started 1/24/2020 5:32:59 AM
Location=Myrtle Beach, SC USA 
Joined=40 months ago   MB Posts=338  
... Most Recent Post
rum
Frankfort, KY USA

this may not apply to your environment, but,

I have had similar issues when the users permission is restricted in the PRIVATE directory.

This tends to happen when the user is in a Terminal Servier or Citrix environment,  The private folder is set by default to some folder buried in the Program Files area of the servers C:.   You might try manually controlling that  with the -p<path>  command line to see if the error is affected in any way.

 Posted 5 days ago
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Post ID #17835 (Level 5.1)  Reply to 17834 and Parent is 15153
Thread Started 1/24/2020 7:30:09 AM
Location=Frankfort, KY USA 
Joined=31 months ago   MB Posts=101  
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Steven.G
Myrtle Beach, SC USA

both users, you've gone into Tools/Settings and confirmed that the working dir is the same?

both users, you've moved off the record and see it get committed? and/or did it in code, and the postrecord() returned true?

both users, you've added new records and posted them?

you can look at the table on either session, after the form closes, and only see User 1's work?

it all looks like it's the same, on paper, but the behavior you're describing is that they're NOT the same table.. even tho that seems impossible

Steven Green
Senior Software Engineer
Paradox Support Specialist DOS/WIN

Prestwood IT Solutions
8421 Auburn Blvd, Suite 256, Citrus Heights, CA 95610
Office: 916-726-5675 | Fax: 916-726-5676 | http://www.prestwood.com
 Posted 8 months ago
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Post ID #17506 (Level 8) and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 5/2/2019 1:33:38 PM
Location=Myrtle Beach, SC USA 
Joined=40 months ago   MB Posts=338  
SamSpade
DBusSol
-- USA

Steve, 

I figured it out, and I‘ll get to that.

But yes, I was doing it in code, adding new records, populating the fields, doing a post record, etc 10 records at a click and each user was having it‘s own reality, and only the user that opened the table first was able to save those edits.  If user1 opened the table made edits and closed, User2 could open the table, see user1s edits, make new edits, close the table and save edits.  But not two users at once.

I am convinced the first user to open the table was the only one to actually have rights to write to the table.  The other users were taking the table into memory, appeared to be making edits in memory only, but unable to write those edits to the table.  I have seen this in previous versions of Server, I am pretty sure its oplocks allowing it.

Now that I figured out the settings I have wrong, the same form, unaltered is allowing multiple users to post records to the table with the behavior we want and expect.

 Posted 8 months ago
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Post ID #17507 (Level 9) and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 5/2/2019 5:22:03 PM
Location=-- USA 
Joined=8 months ago   MB Posts=13  
SamSpade
DBusSol
-- USA

So.... And the Answer is..... Drum Roll Please!!

Combination of Oplocks enabled and Init|LocalShare set to False.

Server 2016 has Oplock settings in SMBServerConfiguration (new to me) and it defaults to enabled. 

When I setup the CFG file, with oplocks enabled, it would not allow a second user to open if Init|LocalShare set to true.  So I had left Localshare set to false. It took me a while to track down the SMB set commands.  It also turned out disabling Oplocks in SMB left out the LanmanWorkstation Oplocks setting (it did turn t off in in Lanmanserver). After my earlier long post, I thought to go back and try with LocalShare set to True.  With Oplocks disabled, LocalShare set to true no longer blocked multiple users and the expected behavior returned to normal.

I am going to admit that even though I have been working in Paradox since about 1992, I don't have a great understanding of Localshare.  I always try to have a Share that I point to with a mapped drive for my App directory even on a terminal server, and I think that makes local share less important. But This is some elses server, I am using a direct C:\Paradox\App\ directory setup. I think having the tables off the C:\ like this is what makes Localshare set to true necessary. I think I found that in some notes by "Mike" years ago. But since I rarely use a C:\ path, I don't think I see that behavior and turning off Oplocks is enough.

 Posted 8 months ago
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Post ID #17508 (Level 10) and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 5/2/2019 5:33:42 PM
Location=-- USA 
Joined=8 months ago   MB Posts=13  
SamSpade
DBusSol
-- USA

So to Recap, here is the setup I ended up with that was successfull for multi users on a 2016 Terminal Server with Paradox11 runtime.

Open Powershell as an Administrator and use these to correct server 2016 defaults:

Set-SmbServerConfiguration -EnableLeasing $false
Set-SmbServerConfiguration -EnableOplocks $false
Set-SmbClientConfiguration -OplocksDisabled $true
Set-SmbClientConfiguration -UseOpportunisticLocking $false

Confirm the settings with
get-SMBClientConfiguration
get-SMBServerconfiguration

While in Powershell Open Regedit an Confirm these Keys
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\lanmanserver\parameters]
"EnableOpLocks"=dword:00000000
"EnableOpLockForceClose"=dword:00000001
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\lanmanworkstation\parameters]
"EnableOplocks"=dword:00000000

Restart the server

Install Paradox 11 Runtime

Setup a diectory that is accessible to all users in the same way.  I prefer a share with a mapped drive. Make sure all users have full control of the contents of the directory and it inherits to its contents.

In the CFG, Set the Net Dir in the CFG to a location common to all users and set System|Init|LocalShare to True.

Use Paradox Shortcut command line settings -P to set unique :Priv: Dirs, -W to set a common :Work: Dir and -O to set a .CFG

The SMB portion is new to me for Server2016. I found them on community.esri.com searching for Oplocks Server 2016.

The Local Share goes back to CFG settings Mike Prestwood published here sometime before 2008.

I have been using the Oplocks settings since Windows NT.

The Command line values are good hygene someone taught me when I got started.

Someone might point out something I haven't documented, but I seem to be working now.

 Posted 8 months ago
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Post ID #17509 (Level 11) and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 5/2/2019 6:01:39 PM
Location=-- USA 
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Steven.G
Myrtle Beach, SC USA

good work, I know it wasn't easy.. these notes will come in handy for others, of course.. the Windows side of almost anything gets more complex, version after version

the one thing about "local share".. it assumes anything on a C drive is private, and yes, therefore thinks holding changes in memory is ok.. orginally, the need for TRUE was when there were other local apps using the data.. this logic goes all the way back to PdoxDOS, where "Edit" held everything in memory til the end, but "CoEdit" posted immediately

over time, of course, we learned that safety and security were way more important than the time saved holding stuff in memory, when you're playing with data.. local share off, oplocks on, caching on, etc.. all bad.. VERY bad

Steven Green
Senior Software Engineer
Paradox Support Specialist DOS/WIN

Prestwood IT Solutions
8421 Auburn Blvd, Suite 256, Citrus Heights, CA 95610
Office: 916-726-5675 | Fax: 916-726-5676 | http://www.prestwood.com
 Posted 8 months ago
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Post ID #17511 (Level 12) and Parent is 15153
Reply Posted 5/3/2019 7:12:21 AM
Location=Myrtle Beach, SC USA 
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